And it’s Sonia Deol with you on your radio and we have with us a very, very special guest live in the studio.
Sonia Deol: Today’s guest’s been described as a mentor, as a counselor and a guide and so on towards the people around her, right from her school days. She considers herself a citizen of the world, someone who doesn’t belong to one specific religion, tradition or powerful label and she is in this country; she’s already been to several places, Bradford, Leicester, and London and is now in Birmingham. It gives me great pleasure to welcome Anandmurti Gurumaa with us here on the BBC Asian Network. ‘Namaskar’!
Sonia Deol: How are you?
Gurumaa: I am good. Hello!
Sonia Deol: Looks as though I’ve finally meet you, because I was looking at you in so many videos, ‘apke’ videos on You Tube and everywhere and you really have, I must say, a massive following.
Gurumaa: Well, I think so everyone loves to be in a happy, happy state of mind and somehow they have the money, they have a house, they have a job, they have a wife, they have a husband, they have kids; but one thing they don’t have, that’s happiness. And that’s what somehow brings people closer to me. Because I teach them, be an architect and create your happiness.
Sonia Deol: What does that mean really, be an architect and create your happiness?
Gurumaa: The thing is this that within us, deep, deep, deep in our mind roots, there is a reservoir, there is an ocean of happiness, an ocean of ‘ananda’ as we say in ‘Sanskrit’ and that is the only thing which we need; and once we know how to make an access to that, we can’t be, not even for one single second, in a sorry, sorry mood. We can’t be in that.
Sonia Deol: We were trying to work out your age when you came in, because the things that you talk about and that you are known for are like the sort of things that you would get from a very old, wise person, but you look very, very young.
Gurumaa: Sonia, a donkey will remain a donkey even if he is thirty years old. Age has nothing to do with your brains.
Sonia Deol: Really!
Sonia Deol: See, we talk about it always, that wisdom comes through age as you get older.
Gurumaa: Ah, they actually mean by experience and some people are born dead in their brain and they die dead in their brain. They are just working through their senses; they are just working because of their basic instincts, impulses and urges. That’s for food, sex and sleep. That’s it.
Sonia Deol: Your basic needs?
Gurumaa: Yes, they just live for that, to fulfill that, to earn money to fulfill these things and that’s it, they don’t think, they are not thinking, and you are human, because you can think. If you are not thinking about say who you are, what this universe is, who the hell God is, if God is, and then who God is. Because if someone says to you, OK think that you are eating ‘roti’ or a burger or a pizza, or a salad, but they never offer you the food, the real food, but just a photograph, would you be satisfied with that?
Sonia Deol: Well, you wouldn’t, would you?
Gurumaa: It’s a very logical thing to say that you won’t be, but isn’t it strange that people are happy with the photos of their Gurus and Gods alone?
Sonia Deol: Right, I see where this is going now. I was wondering where that was going. So, in other words, we kind of, when we worship, when we pray, you are saying – sometimes, well, we are not actually connecting.
Gurumaa: Actually, if I say it truthfully, we are just fooling ourselves. If I write down on a piece of paper – Water – and ask you to lick it, would your thirst be quenched?
Sonia Deol: No.
Gurumaa: No? But that’s what you are doing, ‘Ram, Ram, Ram’ on your tongue and your mind is still thirsty.
Sonia Deol: R-i-g-h-t!!
Gurumaa: Someone is doing Allah Ho Allah Ho, someone is doing ‘Wahe Guru’, someone is doing ‘Devi’ – so many names are there, but does it make a difference if I use H20, water, ‘jal’, ‘neer’, ‘toye’, these different names? But it is still aqua, still it won’t quench your thirst, until you taste the real water in your mouth and you gulp it down.
Sonia Deol: How do you do that then?
Gurumaa: That is where I come in. That is where my role begins. The understanding would only happen by internalizing the mind, by stabilizing the mind, by gaining the ability to reach to the levels where your mind is concentrated, totally conscious, and totally aware; and you begin to go into this inner exploration of what is the mind. The mind is the hell-maker and yet we don’t know what this mind is. We are carrying this bomb in us, this whole mind.
Sonia Deol: This is all very deep and very serious.
Gurumaa: Oh yes, it is. But I can just say the jokes for you (laughs).
Sonia Deol: No, not at all. We are hoping that over the next half hour, we are going to take a lot away.
Gurumaa: I hope so.
Sonia Deol: And learn from you stuff that we can apply to our lives. So, I’ll just say that first, Anandmurti Gurumaa, our special guest on the BBC Asian Network and if you have any questions yourself, your questions that you want answered from Anandmurti Gurumaa, then call us on this number, 08-459-440-445, text 81869, or email at email@example.com .
I don’t suppose you watch cricket at all, do you?
Gurumaa: I do.
Sonia Deol: Oh, you are watching cricket, you are not, really?
Gurumaa: I see the craziness happening on the field and I see these people who are having this adrenaline rush and so are the people watching. So, I observe that, definitely.
Sonia Deol: What do you think about people who go mad about sports like the World Cup when the football was on and the cricket now?
Gurumaa: Well, because they don’t know how to go mad in their inner ecstasy, they have to do something, so they watch cricket or football.
Sonia Deol: 11.35, BBC Asia Network this is Sonia Deol, with special guest, Anandmurti Gurumaa, Specialist here from India, with a huge following and somebody who says, ‘look – you know, you got modern day pressures and those stresses and well, all sorts of unhappiness in life and you want to get rid of those and make your life a lot calmer and a lot more peaceful; then, hey – I can actually help with that, which is quite a tall order because, you know to take away people’s worries, you can’t – no one can take somebody’s worries away.’
Gurumaa: They are imaginary worries actually. They have created it in their heads and it’s easier to plump their heads and bring them to their senses.
Sonia Deol: Very nice.
Gurumaa: Oh, yes.
Sonia Deol: Listen, before we get into all of that, I just wanted to fill in another gap, if you may. Just to get an idea, when did all this happen for you? You were born in Amritsar.
Gurumaa: Well, that’s a mysterious question: actually even I am looking for the answer to that.
Sonia Deol: Seriously, you are quite young, you look so young.
Gurumaa: Let us say, I was born like this, maybe. I was a pretty mischievous child, naughty child as any normal child would be, but I was just fortunate enough that I had access to great people who had great brains and lovingly, jokingly in a fun, game type, I learnt up all this stuff and I never ever came to notice when from a student, I became a master myself.
Sonia Deol: Really!!!
Gurumaa: It was an effortless, effortless…
Sonia Deol: In your teenage years and in your twenties then, when you started?
Gurumaa: It started at age 12.
Sonia Deol: Right, 12 years’ old? Really, how, what was the story, what happened?
Gurumaa: Story? OK, story is interesting, my Mum was frequenting one session. I found this gentleman who was a very saintly man, very wise, very intelligent. So I got intrigued, what the hell is going on, why are these people sitting and what is he saying? But when I heard it, I liked it, then I joined it and by the end of those 5-6 days, the whole thing had changed.
Sonia Deol: At the age of 12?
Gurumaa: I started experimenting with all those things I was hearing. And then came the stage of reading, then came the stage of meeting various, various people and then came the stage where, I would say it’s a grace, I would say it’s a blessing, that it just explodes. And when it explodes……..
Sonia Deol: What’s it?
Gurumaa: This it is basically the veil of the darkness, the veil of the ignorance on your consciousness. Once that gets lifted, voila, you are in that infinite source of wisdom, knowledge, intuition and everything.
Sonia Deol: You must have been born into a particular religion where all of us, especially when you are an Indian or a Pakistani, Bangladeshi, whatever background, family’s religion is very important to our culture. And also to our identities. And you say that there were no boundaries, you don’t believe in any boundaries, do you?
Gurumaa: I don’t, I don’t. I sing ‘Rumi’, I sing ‘Bulle Shah’, I sing ‘Sultan Bahu’, I sing verses from the ‘Guru Granth Sahib’, I sing ‘Kabir’, ‘Sahjo’, ‘Meera’, name it, and we do the Christian mystics here and there; and my work has been so wide. If you go to the website, you will come to know that so much has been done. But every bit of it was, let me put it more simply for you Sonia. You have a certain ‘mithai’ in front of you, ‘sevaian, gulab jamun, rasmalai’, and so on. All the Asian sweets. How are those sweetened, with sugar? Minus the sugar, no sweet is sweet. So there would be differences in forms, colors and shapes, but one thing is similar, and that is sugar. So I say, I got an access to the sugar of all the religions.
Sonia Deol: ‘To aap unko kya kahte hain’, and I’m just going to break into Hindi if I may, for there are a lot of people who follow you, OK ‘aur woh log Hindi mein zyada samajhte hain. Ki jo log kahte hain ki bas yahi majhab ko follow karo, yahi religion ko follow karo. Doosre religions ko na dekho. Unko aap kya kahte hain?’
Gurumaa: I respect people’s freedom to make their choices. I have nothing against that. ‘Lekin mein yah kahti hun ki kyunki aap roz dal nahin khate, roz sabzi nahin khate, roz chawal nahin khate, roz roti nahin khate, jab aap khane mein itni variety chahte hain, to phir aapko yah dekhne mein kya harz hai agar mein paani jal, toye, neer bolun, tab bhi mein paani hi bol rahi hun. Usi tarah ek parmatma ko vibhinn logon ne alag alag tarikon se jana, pehchana. Pahuche woh ek hi srot par, ek hi source par, lekin unki bhasha alag thi, unka expression alag hai. Unki personality alag thi. Is liye unki jo style of teaching thi, woh alag thi’. And that’s the beauty of every religion. So why should we miss on that?
Sonia Deol: Yes. We’ve got Rajni on the line from Durham. Hello Rajni, would you like to speak to Gurumaa?
Rajni: Yes, I would like to.
Gurumaa: Hello Rajni.
Rajni: ‘Paranam Gurumaa’. ‘Aisa hai ki’, I want to ask you, how to achieve peace within myself, because at the moment I am troubled with relationship with my husband. We have been married for 48 years. I am trying each and everything but I can’t change him.
Gurumaa: Rajni, I sympathize with you, ‘aapke saath meri puri hamdardi hai, ki aap 48 saal ke baad yah samajh paa rahi hain ki jis bande se aap mohabbat karte rahe hain, woh banda aapko vaisi mohabbat nahin de raha hai’. ‘Yah mind level par aapki’ differences’ hain’. ‘Lekin ek baat mujhe bataiye Rajni, kya tum apne man ko badal sakti ho?’ ‘Agar uttar nahin hai, jo ki aane wala hai’, which I know.
Rajni: ‘Mein koshish kar rahi hun’.
Gurumaa: ‘Nahi, nahi, nahi. Rajni, aise nahi. Koshish nahi hoti. Ya hota hai ya nahi hota hai. Agar aap apne man ko badal loge, to yeh aapke liye zyada achcha rahega. Kisi ka man badalna mushkil hota hai, mujhse puchho, main nahin badal pati hun. Main koshish karti hun’.
Rajni: ‘Main apne mind ko kaise’………..I tell myself in each and every way.
Gurumaa: ‘Ji’, right, Rajni, just listen to me. What my suggestion to you is – 1) Begin to do pranayam and begin to do the mantra chanting, ‘jis mantra mein bhi aapki shraddha hai, aap agar meri website mein jayenge to us mantra ko karne ka sahi tarika kya hai, usko sikhiye. CD ke saath kariye aur aap jab regularly karne lag jayenge aur is baat ko achche se samajh lijiye, rishte achche hon ya rishte achche nahin hon, hain to saare kachche hi’, time pass ‘ho raha hai sabka, asli rishta humara parmeshwar se hai, aur woh humare hi andar hai aur woh bechara taras raha hai. Aur tu usko dekh bhi nahin rahi hai’. ‘Isliye’, don’t believe it, practice it. ‘Maanne se kya hota hai, maano nahi, jaano’.
Rajni: ‘Mein to subah bahut pranayam bhi karti hun’ and I do meditation. I do so many things.
Gurumaa: Rajni, I really doubt. ‘Kisi ne kaha meine paani piya, pyaas nahin bujhi’. ‘Asal mein usne paani ki jagah’ tincture ‘pi liya tha’. So, ‘uska gala jal gaya’. ‘Aap kah rahe ho mein’ meditation ‘karti hun, par mere man mein ab bhi dukh hai, to mein pakka pakka kah sakti hun’, I can write it down; you don’t know how to do meditation. With due respect, please ‘is baat ko samajhiye, aap thoda koshish kare agar sahi tarike se jaan payen, agar aap aa sake to’ Stourbridge ‘main aa jaiyega, 16th se 21st tak hum meditation retreat kara rahe hain, jahan aap mere saath rahenge’.
Gurumaa: Yes, ‘to aap agar website par jayenge’, you will get all the details. Rajni, if you really want to bring peace to yourself, maybe give me a chance, I’ll try and maybe we’ll get a good result and you’ll be the happier person.
Rajni: All right.
Gurumaa: OK, bye.
Rajni: ‘Shukriya’, thank you.
Sonia Deol: Thank you very much. Listen, I’ve got to ask you a question that connects with what Rajni was saying there. An email has come in from Anjali and she says could you please answer this question, Gurumaa that while meditating; it’s easy to sit after some practice, but how to make the mind still? And I think this is a really common question for lots of people. When you sit down, if you are religious or if you meditate, you sit down to do your prayers or meditation. My first question is, is there a particular time when it is most effective?
Gurumaa: Anjali, see, every time is a good time provided your body is not exhausted. If you are tired and exhausted, you may sit at any time, that won’t work well for you.
Sonia Deol: So I’ve heard some people say, early morning is better, you should wake up, you know.
Gurumaa: The reason is this that the nature is giving good eons, they are in the air.
Sonia Deol: The energy around.
Gurumaa: Yes, the energy, the good energy at the moment. So that provides the right kind of ambience. So if you have a good night’s sleep, you are rested well, take your bath, maybe wash your face and hands, freshen up and sit. Now, for the sake of all the listeners, I am saying this tip for everyone. ‘Aur bhi joh wahan par nahi pahuch payenge, koi baat nahi, aap ghar hi mein isko kar lena’. Sit straight with your spine erect, step no.1. Step 2, close your eyes, step 3, do deep inhalation and exhalation. ‘Jab mein’ deep ‘bolti hun, to pahli baar main aapne ek, do teen ginte hue liya aur aise hi ek, do teen ginkar saans ko chhoda. Phir agli baar aap koshish karen ki teen ki jagah char, phir agli baar koshish karen chaar ki jagah paanch, to aap shwas ko lamba karte jain aur gehra karte jain. Agar aapne itna bhi kaam kar liya to man to wahin pyare ruk jata hai. Man ko rukana koi mushkil kaam hai nahi, jaise machli ke liye tairna mushkil nahi hai, aise hi sach to ye hai, har insaan ka man tadap raha hai us shanti ko……..’
Sonia Deol: So ‘ye jo, jab aap’ meditation ‘karte hain’, or maybe for the first few minutes, ‘aapki’ concentration 100%’ hoti hai’.
Gurumaa: One minute, let me say. For the beginning first few minutes, there won’t be any attentiveness or concentration because so much of thoughts have gone in and so much of emotional traumas, experiences, feelings, sensations and perceptions have gone in the mind. So, initially the mind would sort it out. At that time, you need to be patient and tolerant and that is the time you should practice your deep breathing.
Sonia Deol: Doesn’t the deep breathing clear all the clutter? You are praying, you are meditating and all that and all of a sudden, you are thinking about other things.
Gurumaa: Technically, let me say it, when you take deep inhalations, a larger amount of oxygen which would go in with the air. When you take it slowly, then the time when the gas exchange would happen in your alveoli, in your lungs, that’s for a longer period, which means there would be larger amount of oxygen going in the blood and this blood is circulated in the brain and the whole body; and this nourished, oxygenated blood is going to put your brain into ease; and the more oxygen going into your body, the serotonin and melatonin hormones will get released in your brain, which will soothe you. Well, melatonin gets released only in deep sleep and now we are producing that same similar state while we are up, awake, conscious and melatonin and serotonin will give you the benefits of the deep sleep while you are totally conscious.
Sonia Deol: OK.
Gurumaa: That’s the technology behind doing the….
Sonia Deol: Should you have silence around you?
Gurumaa: Yes, that works, that definitely works. See, you need this kind of right ambience and props for you. That’s why I insist that people use my CD. I’ve created that music, I’ve created that sound, and I have created step-by-step instructions.
Sonia Deol: And what about meditation? As an individual, by yourself or in groups? Do you believe that some spiritualists say that if you meditate in a big group, it’s more effective, it’s better for you.
Gurumaa: It is not necessary, because if you are there, then you are there and you might be in a bigger group and yet, you will be lost. It has nothing to do with being in a group because once your eyes are closed, how does it matter how many people are around you? But it’s a psychological effect that the energies of other people will help me. Well, let me point it out, if that would have been the case, then wouldn’t we have had one enlightened person who gave energy to the whole world and the whole world became a heaven? Well, that never happened, so this means you have to create your own energy.
Sonia Deol: We have Special Guest, Anandmurti Gurumaa on the BBC Asia Network and very little time and so, if you have any questions, ‘agar aap koi sawal Anandmurti Gurumaa se karna chahte hain to aap abhi hamein’ phone ‘kar sakte hain is’ number ‘par’, 08459-440445. Lots of questions in regard to ……., let me put it in a nutshell, the word how, how do you bring peace, calm and happiness into your life when you might have problems with the in-laws, your family, your partners, your kids, work colleagues?
Gurumaa: The problem is this that – no.1 missing point is, you have no connection with your own self. No.2 missing point, you do not know how your mind functions. No.3 – you have too many expectations from the people who are lost themselves and who, in lieu of their expectations, are also waiting that you would do the game for them. Fourth, too much of competition, if she has a solitaire, then I have to have one. If she has a bigger house, then I have to have one. If she has an Armani, Gucci dress, then I too have to have one. So, this competitiveness, too much of desires and these desires are making you crazy. You say how to be silent, drop the desires dear, you will be very happy. See, let me just quote, I am loving this couplet which is coming in my head. ‘Bulle Shah’ says, ‘Chah, chah’ means desire, ‘chah churi, churi’ means scavenger or sweeper. ‘Chah churi, chahna ichha, chah churi, chah chamyari, chah neechan di neech, tu te aape rab seh, je chahna hundi teej’.
Sonia Deol: What does that mean? It sounds lovely, but what does it mean?
Gurumaa: Gurumaa: ‘Chahna’ means desire, so desire is the lowliest thing which is within you and as it used to be in old days that ..
Sonia Deol: OK, question coming into my head. So you are saying, if you are feeling ‘chahna, ye chahna’, you are talking about the material one that people have, ‘mujhe gaari chahiye’.
Gurumaa: I am not saying drop the necessities. Thats the difference. ‘Jo hamare sharir ki zaroorate hain’, for example, ‘khana, ek ghar, dawai ke liye paise, gaari chalani hai to gari ke liye paise bhi chahiye aur gari bhi chahiye’. You can’t survive without that, you will be a fool if you think you can. No one can do that. We need to do work, our basic urges ‘ki’ satisfaction ‘ke liye, kaam karna padega’. But, then we have to draw the line.
Sonia Deol: And lower your expectations.
Gurumaa: See, there is sale, for example, you are getting 70% off, you bought five dresses, you bought all those five dresses. You hung them up in your cupboard. You never got the time to wear those. Thats silliness. Stop that.
Sonia Deol: Do you think that causes unhappiness?
Gurumaa: That causes lot of bad debt.
Sonia Deol: Right, yes. Here’s another question I’ll throw at you. Somebody who says, OK Gurumaa, you are talking about these material ones. I don’t have the material ones. However, you know, I’m a person, I’m wanting to have peace and calm and tranquility in my life. But Gurumaa, I can’t control the external forces around me. I have a mother-in-law or I have a husband or I have a wife, or I have a brother or a sister and these people are creating tensions, ‘main kya karun’?
Gurumaa: OK, these are lame excuses. Once I do not know how to manage my own mind and here I am thinking I will manage minds of other people. Thats the most foolish thing to think. Beginning, manage your own mind.
Sonia Deol: ‘Lekin’ they say, ‘wo mujhe upset karte hain’.
Gurumaa: ‘Nahin, nahin’, see if it is raining outside, what would you do, sit at home or wear your raincoats, umbrellas and gumboots and go out?
Sonia Deol: How do you wear your raincoats?
Gurumaa: By attaining wisdom and having integrity. People don’t have integrity. They are emotionally dependent on each thing and person around them and they are just, you know, like a puppet and their strings are in the hands of other people, so they pull the strings and they fall down and they pull the strings and you are doing the dance. And they pull the string, you are sad and so, are you a person, a living person with a mind and head or are you just a brainless puppet? People live their life as a puppet. They have given their remote control in someone else’s hand. We humans are such emotional fools. We get fooled so easily and we throw ourselves to anyone and everyone. Someone tells you a lie, you look good, you begin to believe that. Can’t you see yourself whether you are good or not?
Sonia Deol: Amit says, I am not able to relax during my sleep and feel very stressed. What should I do?
Gurumaa: The reason is, maybe you have too much of pressure on your mind, too many things running on in your mind. And the mind is the best secretary who will keep on reminding you that you have to do this. Well, either you do those things and the best part is, you need to prioritise what needs to be given attention in the first go and then the second and then the third. And the fourth thing which I would suggest Amit is, please get one of my CDs called Yoga Nidra, N-i-d-r-a, Nidra, yogic sleep. Get it from my website, you can download it, this will really help you to have a deep sleep and you can relax at muscular, skeletal, emotional and nervous levels and you will definitely enjoy good sleep.
Sonia Deol: Somebody who has read one of your books, Rays of Light, Man Singh, his email came in, he says, ‘it helped me a lot. What is happiness though’? This is my question, ‘if money is not making us satisfied, then why on earth are we running behind that? What is happiness’?
Gurumaa: Happiness is not pleasure, no.1. Happiness is not an ego trip. You can experience pure happiness just by watching a rainbow. You can be happy just by seeing the sun rising on the horizon and the rain drops falling on your face; and just laughing not because you have heard a joke or you have heard a stand-up comedian but just simple laughter. Just watch small kids, they don’t need a reason to smile, they jump, they dance and they are laughing without a reason. So what did you earn by thinking a lot because your thinking has corrupted and polluted your mind and you are that unhappy. Maybe be as innocent as a child is, give time to yourself when you can just jump, jump, jump, jump.
Sonia Deol: Khyati is on the line, hello Khyati!
you are through to Anandmurti Gurumaa.
Khyati: I just want to ask you that I have a job interview coming up at the end of the week and I feel very nervous, I know I’m going to be nervous and it hinders me from being successful. If you ask me a question, my lips come out the wrong way, you know.
Sonia Deol: OK, so your job interview is at the end of this week?
Sonia Deol: And you get very nervous at interviews? I guess your question is you want to know how can you be confident and get away?
Gurumaa: No.1, listen, baby just listen. When you are confident about what you know, then just be focussed about what you know and then forget about what you don’t know and what you know, be grounded on that and say to yourself, I know it, because once you know it, then you won’t forget it. The reason is the mind begins to go into the multi-faceted colours, so one mind is saying I know it, one mind says I don’t know it, one mind says you’ll forget it. So all this hotch potch in your mind actually confuses you and takes away your confidence. Just be focused more on what you know and maybe you should try practising deep breathing a lot more and maybe you do the chant of either ‘Ek Onkar’ or ‘Om’, whatever works for you or nothing, just do deep breathing and breathe in a long breath through your nose but exhale it out through your mouth, make the shape of an ‘O’ with your lips, and let the air go out slowly. Do it for ten minutes and walk into any office and blow them out with your confidence.
Sonia Deol: I love that. What’s this deep, deep, explain that thing again to me, what you do with the ‘O’?
Gurumaa: When you say ‘O’, a big ‘O’, with rounded lips, right? Make that shape because this will allow the exhalation to get lengthened. The more lengthened out exhalation means you will be bringing out more carbondioxide out of your blood.
Sonia Deol: So there is a science behind what you are saying.
Gurumaa: Yes, there is a science. See, I don’t do silly things. I don’t believe in silly things and I…
Sonia Deol: What do you mean by silly things?
Gurumaa: Silly things, where you don’t know what it is, like someone just made a mark, any mark and said, ‘Ok, bow to it, this a religious sign’. What is the religion in that, what does the sign have to do with that, right?’ See, there is a definite sign given by our rishis, our sages were metaphysicists. They were the ones who had explored the subconscious, unconscious, acroconscious levels, which still upto this day the psychiatrists of the western world haven’t found.
Sonia Deol: Khyati, does that help you? Good luck with your interview. Thank you very much. We are going to hold on to Anandmurti Gurumaa until after the news. So, stay with us and keep listening to the BBC Asian Network.
I have got a question for you and its slightly controversial but I know that you always speak your mind, so I feel safe I can ask you this question. What do you think of people who say, ‘Oh listen, ‘aapne yah pareshani dur karni hai, to aap yah pahno’.’ I want to know when they put this on, do they…….
Gurumaa: When you are weak in mind and you have greed and fear in your mind, anyone can make you a ‘bewakuf’. And these are all things which are being done. I am amazed when I come to UK and US, I am finding so many ‘babas’ and these people who are claiming that in one go…, but you have to pay them a big amount and then they run away. I was just a guest in one home where they had some issues, relationship issues and they had spent maybe 20-30 thousand pounds on these ‘babas’. And nothing worked and still the husband and wife got separated. So now I said, you would have been better off going to a marriage counsellor.
Sonia Deol: Right, thats interesting. There are a lot of these people…..
Gurumaa: See, people are looking for miracles to happen and let me tell you, nature in itself is the biggest miracle. Don’t look for this ‘jadugiri’ and those people who are making fools of you and there is no one who can take away the share of your miseries because your karma is going to come back and give you the fruits and how can you run away?
Sonia Deol: So you don’t believe that if you wear a particular coloured stone, thats going to bring you luck and all this kind of stuff?
Gurumaa: No, thats just crap, thats just crap.
Sonia Deol: I love your frankness and the way you just give me your opinion. We’ll have more from Anandmurti Gurumaa in a further Asia hour.
Gurumaa: Well, I can go more.
Sonia Deol: No, I don’t think thats right. Anandmurti Gurumaa, our special guest here on the BBC Asian Network. It is Sonia Deol on your radio here on the BBC Asian Network and our special guest is Anandmurti Gurumaa, who has been talking to us over the last half hour, still with us because we have so many questions to throw at her. This question has come in from Moni, who says, ‘ great show, loves the positiveness from this lady that you have on the show. I am always very positive talking to others, so much so that I have taken voluntary redundancy from the company I currently work at. I am about to work at my own business. I am going for an interview today for a contract, so I am going with the mindset that I already have it’. Now, do you believe that ‘ki agar’, like if you believe, if you genuinely believe you are going to get something, then you will have it?
Gurumaa: Oh yes, why not? See, we have the energy. We are the divine beings, we are not just mortal beings. Yes, our frames, the physical body is the mortal one, but deep, deep, deep inside we are the immortal ones. So, whatever we wish, we will get, but provided, if we ask for something bad, even that would come. If I ask for something good, it will come to me. This is the power of the mind, only if people could learn how to use it positively.
Sonia Deol: What are your views on ‘kismat, karma’, the stuff that we are going through in this life? Is it due to the past life? What are your thoughts on that?
Gurumaa: A minute ago was our past and a minute which is yet to come, is our future. This is how close the past and the future is. So, we were the creators of our destiny in our that past time. One hour ago, two hours ago to one week, one year, ten years, thats already our past.
Sonia Deol: More about this idea, because I hear it a lot. You know if something goes wrong in your life, you are going through a difficult time, people say, ‘Oh, you know ‘maarey karm kitte hoye’, you must have done something bad in the past life’.
Gurumaa: In a way, I would say, no, no, in a way it is true, but its the half-truth, not the full truth because, see I don’t see that there is anything which can be miserable and just a suffering alone. I believe every suffering comes to make us more strong, gives us the very important lesson, what not to do in your relationships or what not to expect from others or from yourself. But if you are a fool, then you don’t grab the lesson and keep on doing the same mistakes again and again.
Sonia Deol: What are your thoughts on ‘nazar’, because again there is a very strong belief in ‘nazar’ and you kind of touched on, you said there were a lot of ‘babas’ and they were making money.
Gurumaa: People have superiority complexes that they are good, great, rich and then they have the fear so for that they have an inferiority complex too that they are fragile and someone’s evil ‘nazar’ would take everything away from them. So they are just people with weak minds which is……..
Sonia Deol: ‘Aap maante hain ki nazar lagti hai logon ki?’
Gurumaa: ‘Arrey, kuch nahin lagti, mujhe lagti na sabse pahle, karoron log dekhte hain, sau gaali dete hain, hazar pyar karte hain, sabse pahle mujhe nazar lagni chahiye thi. Mujhe to lagi nahin, tumhe kahan se lag jayegi?’ And I think so, I look good enough.
Sonia Deol: You look very good. You look very good. ‘Lekin aap dekhte hain na, aas paas aap dekhte hain na, log kahte hain ki dekho, Anandmurti Gurumaa, mera business itna, its not so good. Mere padosi ki nazar lag gayi’.
Gurumaa: Those who hear me regularly, will never say these stupid things. They are pretty wise enough, they will never talk about this and unfortunately, those who have not heard me, who have not empowered their mind, ‘un bicharon ke liye takleef zindagi bhar rahti hai. Zindagi bhar vo’ compare ‘karte rahte hain, zindagi bhar vo dar ke saath jeete hain, phobia hai unke andar. Ki cheezen chali jayengi, gum ho jayengi, aur chunki unke apne man mein ye burai hoti hai, dusron ki achchi cheezen dekh ke unki laar tapak jati hai’.
Gurumaa: ‘Us ghar mein ladai hai, jhagda hai, aur kya hai’? Bad vibes ‘hain ek dusre ke saath or main ye samajhti hun’, see I am not in favour of ritualistic anything, of any religion. ‘Jab main kahti hun puja, to mere liye puja hai voh aapki manastithi, jahan man mein vishram hai, prem hai, karuna hai, daya hai, ye hai puja mere liye. Jab aap kahte hain dhyan, to dhyan mere liye ek method nahin hai’. A state of mind where the mind has totally gone thoughtless but is fully awake and conscious. That is the state when you create such a reverberating silence within you, then it oozes out and gets an expression of ‘ananda’.
Sonia Deol: Good question this, it’s just come in. What is the point of us being here if we are all money chasing, materialistic, miserable, having pressures in life, what is the point of us being here?
Gurumaa: No, no, no. All these things which you have said, Sonia just now are the conditionings which the society and family gives to the mind, that you have to do this or attain this or arrive at this particular point. The purpose of being human in my opinion, this is an opportunity for us, it opens up a gate to evolve. Its not how much money we make, because at the end of the day, when you breathe your last, you leave your penny or your millions right here, am I right? Every thing is gone. So, this life’s purpose is to know what is eternal and immortal and not only just know it theory-wise, but to experience that. Its a path, it’s a gate, it’s an opportunity where if you use it properly, then you can be a God yourself.
Sonia Deol: The point of life, it’s a learning experience.
Gurumaa: It’s an evolving experience. And that’s the whole problem, we were supposed to eat, sleep, and also sex was the true part of life but all this was meant, that once you have satisfied your basic urges, now work on your mind.
Sonia Deol: Hey, I have a question for you. On my way to work today, as my Dad was dropping me off, there was a car that cut us off, the driver started shouting and waving; and my Dad was like going to rave with him as well. You know, ‘gussa’. How do you control temper?
Gurumaa: You don’t control temper, you go to the root, why anger is coming up. That person must have been terrorised by his wife or girlfriend or children or he might have been kicked. Poor soul, he is going through a lot of suffering. And if someone is in that state, shouldn’t you sympathise with a sick person, that person is just mentally sick. Don’t you sympathise, don’t you ask how are you doing or you had fever or how are you doing, don’t you ask them? Don’t you speak in a mellowed, soft voice to a sick person? You should be doing the same to that person.
Sonia Deol: To a person who is shouting? To somebody who is screaming at your face?
Gurumaa: Ya, that person is going through a horrible time. And if you are wise and sensible and concentrated and fully calm, that is what you can do. Be quiet at that time.
Sonia Deol: What do you say to, you know because some of us are quite emotional. You know, I don’t know, its a story, ‘jo mard hote hain wo bahut’ tough ‘hote hain’, not that I believe it, ‘mard’ are very tough and women are very emotional.
Gurumaa: Men are chicken.
Sonia Deol: What did you say?What do you say to someone who feels they want to be stronger, they want to be confident, all of those things. But actually they feel that emotionally, ‘woh kaafi’ weak ‘hain’. ‘Ki agar unko koi’ challenge ‘kare, to jhatpat aankhon mein aanson aa jaate hain’. Weakness ‘aa jaati hai’.
Gurumaa: See, you take a bath everyday, do you?
Sonia Deol: Yeah, I do. Everyone does. ‘Subah ko snan karna bahut zaroori hai’.
Gurumaa: Good for you. OK. ‘Aap roz is liye nahate hain taaki sharir ki gandagi aur paseena, woh sab nikal jaaye’ and you feel fresh. Now my question, do you do bath of your mind? Do you shower your mind?
Sonia Deol: How would you shower your mind?
Gurumaa: That’s the question, people don’t know how to do that. That’s why they are carrying so much of emotional dirt in them. They are going through a rotten phase within themselves and that is why they are blurting it out on others. No one is being taught how to take that shower which refreshes you up in your mind. You know how to put a good deo, to use a good perfume so that you smell good and no one says, ‘Ah, what is she doing? Why isn’t she using a deo?’ I say, there is a deo needed for your mind too. People don’t know what that is and for that very reason, I am holding this residential retreat in Stourbridge, beginning from 16th July evening, ending on the 21st July morning and that is what I teach, how to take the shower, so that you are happy within your own self.
Sonia Deol: What do you learn? If I came to that, what would I learn on that course?
Gurumaa: All this stuff that I am talking about. So, there are ways, means, methods with which you end up being strong, confident, happy, calm and serene. If you want that, please come there.
Sonia Deol: OK, give me your website address, please.
Gurumaa: It’s gurumaa.com and for your audience, I would like to just pass this information because these days I am not on the TV, but all my satsang videos are available on the website video library and you can just go there. There are hundreds of hours of videos which you can watch and you can also mail me a question and I reply, a video reply that would come to you in your Inbox.
Sonia Deol: Well, so that’s all on your website? Yes, the website address is www,gurumaa.com. And there are lots of videos of Gurumaa on You Tube which I was looking at yesterday. Lots of your meditation, ‘satsangs’ and ‘kirtans’.
Lovely having you on the show.
Gurumaa: Lovely being here, Sonia.
Sonia Deol: Thank you so much.
Gurumaa: Good energy over here.
Sonia Deol: Listen, can you feel that? Are you able to pick up energy?
Gurumaa: Oh yes, I have good antennas.
Sonia Deol: I know you do. One question I did not get in. Just quickly before you go, you had said that you would like to say something about it that you would not say ‘Namaste’ to a non-vegetarian, and you said you had something to say about that. Would you like to say that now?
Gurumaa: Ya, lot of people are asking me this question, why should they be vegetarian? I have just two opinions. I am not saying that I am going to impose it. These are my two opinions. You like it, take it, don’t like it, throw it away. Well, no.1 opinion is that the sun rays are giving energy to the plants and plants are being eaten up by the animals, say goat, cow etc etc and the hens, they are eating those seeds and then you eat their meat or egg. This means the energy is coming to us from a longer route. And when you take it from the plants directly, because we don’t know how to take energy directly from the sun, so the best option is from the plants. We are getting the pure form of energy and minus any animal diseases and all the steriods and antibiotics which go in the animal’s bodies because they are injected so that they give more yield and they don’t fall sick. So, when you use that thing, the meat and the egg, what happens is you are transporting all those diseases, steroids, hormones, growth hormones in your body. So, I believe I love my body, I would wish to keep it for a longer time so I am protecting my body from all those steroids, chemicals and preservatives, No.1. No.2, if you are a religious person, and you know it, you never take meat inside the premises of a temple or a ‘gurudwara’, right? So, if these temples are built by men, your human body is made by God. So don’t take it in your body.
Sonia Deol: Thank you very, very much, Gurumaa. Lovely having you on this show. Good luck with the retreat this weekend. Take care.